08-10-2005, 04:51 AM | #61 | ||
beloved cordelia
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: San Jose, CA
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Were you aiming for Whedonesque and got here by mistake? ***argel***
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Team Cordy™ #17 Charisma's Bitch #17 The Place of Blue Not a Color, But a State of Mind Lisa: Wait, Xena can't fly! Lucy Lawless: I told you, I'm not Xena. I'm Lucy Lawless! Lisa: Oh. |
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08-10-2005, 08:32 AM | #62 |
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 1,145
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To give credit where credit is due, none of us would be here had Joss not created BTVS and then later ATS. Has he written an directed some of the best episodes on both shows? Yes. He has a large cultlike following.
My problems with him are threefold. 1.) In most of the interviews I've read with him, he takes all of the credit for the series success, and is quick to place the failure at the feet of others. He's quick to forget that he didn't do it all himself, though it sounds like that is what he'd want us to believe. 2.) He chose not to bring back the second most associated character with ATS (Cordelia) for its fifth and what would turn out to be last season. Charisma was there with David since the beginning, and deserved to be there in the end. Had she chosen to leave on her own, I wouldn't have had a problem with it, but the way they just unceremoniously dumped her was wrong. 3.) The lack of continuity in seasons four and five. When Greenwalt was running the show in the first three seasons, whether we liked the direction or not, the action still flowed from one episode to the next. In season four, Greenwalt left after a dispute with Fox (who distributed the show), and Whedon brought in his own yes-men. I routinely got headaches from trying to figure out what was going on. Season five was an improvement, but still was nowhere near the first three seasons. |
08-10-2005, 10:01 AM | #63 | |
Dutchess of LaLaLand
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Location: Holland, baby!
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Lindsay merely huffed at her statement. "I see you're taking some for the team these days," he said, eyeing the cane she was still using. "Well, it's hard to top taking a dagger to the jugular, but I do what I can," Lilah shrugged. 'Shipping: CordyღAngel ~ LilahღWesley ~ ReginaღHook |
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08-10-2005, 10:09 AM | #64 | |
It's all about Cordy.
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Fill your hands, you son of a bitch! -- Rooster Cogburn |
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08-10-2005, 11:11 AM | #65 | ||
Concorde crashes into LA
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: None of your business.
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I came here because it was a site based solely for Cordelia lovin'. After a quick read I thought the posters here seemed quite adult and made sensible posts. I didn't expect to find hypocrisy and retardedness from the general consensus. Though this seems the substandard for all fansites of either show.
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Joss: I don't want the giant ego. I don't want to become Kevin Costner, singing on the soundtrack to The Postman. Connor: Its a lie, you can't be saved by a lie. Joss: I like characters more than plots. (Though I demand plots) Cordy:You're a lot smarter than you look! 'Course, you look like a retard. I hate Joss to...honest. |
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08-10-2005, 11:15 AM | #66 | |
Avi by Psychofilly
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Location: UK
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Talk about wearing out your name fast.
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I don't hate Angel, I hate what was done to Angel. There's a difference. GoTeam Angel's Oasis Just For The Hell Of It |
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08-10-2005, 11:23 AM | #67 | |
Rachel Elisabeth
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Real Life Locale: Somewhere in Connecticut. The truth: In my head. It's both scary and quite lovely there.
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Didn't he also have a hand in the script for I Will Remember You -- the guy does like the meladrama a bit, but he also knew when it went a bit over board. Actually in the commentary for the episode with the atrocious "When I kiss you I want to die," he said he thought it was a bit too much at first, but Joss LOVED it. So there you go. Personally, my favorite Cordelia writer is actually David Fury. Every Fury episode written has great Cordy.
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If you don't tell the truth about yourself, you cannot tell it about other people. by Virginia Woolf |
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08-10-2005, 11:28 AM | #68 | ||
Scratch the Surface
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Small and boring town
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08-10-2005, 11:29 AM | #69 | |
*My* Angel eats nuns.
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Houston, TX
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Considering she was fired from the show after a general decline in her character arc and rumored bad treatment on set, the only thing I'm surprised about is that you thought you'd find a bunch of Wedonite ass kissing going on here. Unless you weren't aware of the tension between her and Mutant Enemy. In that case, consider this an education. It's neither hypocrisy nor retarded to be able to acknowledge a shows flaws along with it's writers and creators shortcomings as well as their strengths. Unfortunately on both ATS and BTVS, the last couple of seasons produced episodes that made many characters act unlikeable and/or too stupid to live, and plots that overall didn't engage many viewers. Despite brief flashes of greatness, overall the arcs didn't hold up under logical scrutiny. So sorry if that offends your Whedonass kissing sensibilities.
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"Great, now I'm gonna be stuck with serious thoughts all day." (Cordy) "They say that inside every fat woman there is a skinny woman just waiting to get out...well, I ate that bitch." Last edited by psychofilly; 08-10-2005 at 11:34 AM. |
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08-10-2005, 11:34 AM | #70 | |
Concorde crashes into LA
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Location: None of your business.
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Joss: I don't want the giant ego. I don't want to become Kevin Costner, singing on the soundtrack to The Postman. Connor: Its a lie, you can't be saved by a lie. Joss: I like characters more than plots. (Though I demand plots) Cordy:You're a lot smarter than you look! 'Course, you look like a retard. I hate Joss to...honest. |
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08-10-2005, 11:39 AM | #71 | |
Concorde crashes into LA
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Joss: I don't want the giant ego. I don't want to become Kevin Costner, singing on the soundtrack to The Postman. Connor: Its a lie, you can't be saved by a lie. Joss: I like characters more than plots. (Though I demand plots) Cordy:You're a lot smarter than you look! 'Course, you look like a retard. I hate Joss to...honest. |
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08-10-2005, 11:40 AM | #72 | |
Rachel Elisabeth
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Real Life Locale: Somewhere in Connecticut. The truth: In my head. It's both scary and quite lovely there.
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Charisma was interested in doing WW WAY before Joss Whedon was ever associated with the script. Also: I had an edit to my earlier post that wouldn't post for some reason. It was all about the definition of hypocrisy and how here no main poster is ever hypocrital. Here we are Blunt, Honest and Tactless at times, i.e: We are Cordelia. But we don't do hypocrisy. Also I would just like to point You're Welcome to again read Psychofilly's post and Cordy's Bitch below. ;-)
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If you don't tell the truth about yourself, you cannot tell it about other people. by Virginia Woolf Last edited by writingpathways; 08-10-2005 at 12:03 PM. |
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08-10-2005, 11:41 AM | #73 | ||
Not amused
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,642
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1) Retardedness - Not a word. Even if it was, "retarded" means "slowed", not unintelligent or unthinking. I would rather respond in a "retarded" way rather than in a way that displays rank immaturity, lack of cogent thought, or truculent confrontationalism. 2) You've yet to show one example of our supposed hypocrisy. Enjoying a television show isn't an all or nothing endeavor. I don't have to like everything about a show, or even about a person. Having a critical nature is highly preferable in my opinion to blind sychophancy. 3) We do love Cordelia. We love Charisma. And she knows it. ETA: Why I blame Joss - It's a simple reason, really. These shows were his shows. Their quality, for good or bad, ultimately was his responsibility. And he let it slide into disrepair. That's why I blame Joss. Do I stay up nights, poking pins in my Joss voodoo doll? No. I've better things to do. But if someone asks my opinion, there it is. Quote:
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"Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair. Or fuckin' beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Till then you've got a lot more punishment in store. So stand it like a man, and give some back." Last edited by Cordy's Bitch; 08-10-2005 at 12:07 PM. |
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08-10-2005, 12:05 PM | #74 | |||
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"Wal-mart is like...the WAL-MART of evil." - Jon Stewart "Never continue in a job you don't enjoy. If you're happy in what you're doing, you'll like yourself, you'll have inner peace. And if you have that, along with physical health, you will have had more success than you could possibly have imagined." - Johnny Carson |
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08-10-2005, 12:07 PM | #75 |
Concorde crashes into LA
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: None of your business.
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So what happened behind the scenes then? How was Charisma mistreated? And is there actual proof or is this just heresay?
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Joss: I don't want the giant ego. I don't want to become Kevin Costner, singing on the soundtrack to The Postman. Connor: Its a lie, you can't be saved by a lie. Joss: I like characters more than plots. (Though I demand plots) Cordy:You're a lot smarter than you look! 'Course, you look like a retard. I hate Joss to...honest. |
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