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Old 09-29-2003, 11:14 AM   #1
Penny Century
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AtS on TNT: The Season One Discussion Thread

Here we are again! Use this thread to discuss the Season One reruns that begin on TNT today. Feel free to discuss Season 1 on UPN and other syndication outlets, too.

So whaddaya think, should we open a new Subtext thread, too? Might be fun and a little nostalgic, or not. You guys make the call.
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Old 09-29-2003, 12:03 PM   #2
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Re: AtS on TNT: The Season One Discussion Thread

Quote:
Originally posted by Penny Century
So whaddaya think, should we open a new Subtext thread, too? Might be fun and a little nostalgic, or not. You guys make the call.
I vote yes.

I'm not in the States - but I'll happily throw in a tape each day to join the discussion.
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Old 09-29-2003, 12:18 PM   #3
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Watched "City Of" over the weekend...not to mention "Heartthrob", so it was a double C/A whammy. And I'm pretty sure I'll watch "City Of" again today, just because. It's still got it.

I do wish hadn't editted out Angel jumping into the wrong car. Considering how broody he was that first ep, I remember his mistake being what clued me in that there was going to be more to AtS!Angel than BtVS!Angel. Still, there wasn't too much butchery. Since "City Of" is one of the few season 1 eps I have on tape (which makes you wonder why I'm watching it on broadcast TV) I've watched it a lot. And, aside from Angel jumping into the wrong car, most of what they took out of CO was minor.

As for subtext, I don't know if there needs to be a seperate thread. Folks are probably going to bring it up in this thread anyway, right? But, if there is one, I'll go along.
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Old 09-29-2003, 01:17 PM   #4
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oh I'll throw in also... also a UK baby...

'City of...' ah yes. "Are you still 'grrrr?'"
"There's not actually acure for that."

Classic
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Old 09-29-2003, 03:54 PM   #5
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Wink

Ahh....In the beginning...
"Are you game?" Doyle
"I'm game" Angel

People I belive there is always subtext.... LOL


Cordy: Angel???

Cordy: You don't know who is??? Oh your about to get your ass kicked. (Big Smile)
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Old 09-29-2003, 04:19 PM   #6
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Please. There was subtext all over "City Of".

For example, when Stacy tells Angel to stay away from Russel, or "He'll kill you and everyone you care about." In response, Angel said, "There's nobody left I care about..." and the scene cuts from him to Cordelia, as if to say, "Wanna bet?"

That's subtext right there. And I loved it.
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Old 09-29-2003, 05:49 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by FangGirl
Ahh....In the beginning...
"Are you game?" Doyle
"I'm game" Angel

People I belive there is always subtext.... LOL


Cordy: Angel???

Cordy: You don't know who is??? Oh your about to get your ass kicked. (Big Smile)
That was the best!
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Old 09-29-2003, 06:01 PM   #8
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My favorite part?

"Hey! You're a vampire!"
"No, I'm not."
"Are too!"

And I also loved how when Cordy ordered Angel to get her the box, he actually went to get it and caught himself. lol
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Old 09-29-2003, 06:03 PM   #9
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Angel ask Doyel "You think she is a hottie" about Cordelia. Okay that smile Angel had on his face just prove he also though Cordy was hot too
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Old 09-29-2003, 06:17 PM   #10
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this show looks similar to that new show they have starting this year, it has the same name, and the main character has the same name, and the law firm is the same, but the story is very different.

in this one, they were private detectives with their own agency, and in the new one they are lawyers, but for the same law firm they fought in the old one. but from what i have read the characters are all different. it looks like the new show is just a partial rip-off of this one.


seriously though, they kept the car gag in the tnt show.

i loved seeing cordy with long dark hair, and some of the gyrations her face goes thru when she talks, she is a master of facial expression.

the look on angel's face during the scene where he's telling doyle that 'she's a hottie'.

the only thing i don't like is , we will probably be seeing a lot of the new blond bimboy in the ads from the WB that they are running during this show.
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Old 09-29-2003, 07:43 PM   #11
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You know what really struck me while re-watching City Of...? Angel was a vampire, man. That's what made season one my favorite season. He got burned when he tried to run into the sunlight. He checked out the blood running down that one chick's forehead. He vamped out occasionally. He got injured a lot more. It was cool. I miss that.
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Old 09-30-2003, 12:09 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by canadia
You know what really struck me while re-watching City Of...? Angel was a vampire, man. That's what made season one my favorite season. He got burned when he tried to run into the sunlight. He checked out the blood running down that one chick's forehead. He vamped out occasionally. He got injured a lot more. It was cool. I miss that.
DITTO! I always like the camraderie between Angel, Cordelia and Doyle/Wesley, when they were patching up 'The Dark Avenger'. SOOO missing that. Kinda like the cut scene from 'Home'.
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Old 09-30-2003, 03:11 AM   #13
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Oh Lor, I have GOT to get the DVD’s. I really don’t need to eat or pay rent, not really.

I love the old, dorky, socially awkward Angel. The clumsy horse/elephant who doesn’t know how to talk to anyone. I love that sense of humor like him in the bar talking about “this girl” and how the bald guy next to him reminded him of Buffy.

I love the dark coat swirling around like a cloak. Still think that opening set is a rip off of Fritz Lang’s M.

I miss his old apartment and office. I loved the old dusty office straight out of film noir. I miss the bricks and mortar and the easy sewer access. I loved that J Boo décor with the iron sconces and the layout that never made any sense (wooden doors to the kitchen?) Admittedly the elevator was a bust but I loved the dark shadows of the bedroom and the underground lair feel. And the sunlight in the office was a problem. I remember them saying that they had to reshoot several shots because the directors didn’t get that he shouldn’t be able to walk through the sunlit office that easily like in the later scenes.

Heck, I feel nostalgic about seeing Greenwalt and Minear in the credits.

I love how the first five minutes set the tone as being apart from BtVS. Shadows and gray areas, not sunny hypocrites. It’s dirty, dank and apparently always rainy and grainy. No Gilmore Girls speed dialogue but a stoic grit.

Also miss Quinn and that ever present dimple. Those eyebrows that were always moving and his accent. His silver claddaugh ring that inspired me to write stories.

Also love how they kept in the car scene. That little Magnum PI fallibility that set it aside from the macho supermen.

Looking back, you wonder what would’ve happened if he’d have run into Fred working late at the library while he was researching Tina’s friend. Oh the fanfic possibilities.

I also miss the action/fighting sequences. Tighter shots, less ropes and Matrix nonsense, higher sense of kinetic energy and back alley adrenaline.

I miss Lindsey and the hint of W&H, the machinations behind the internal meetings and senior partners. Not to mention his wolfish, feral, “won’t be tamed” hair and that glint in his eye.

I love how Doyle can’t get into the gate, miss that sense of humor w/ even Wes manning two shotguns at a time. Love the details on that gate of the little crosses. Funny décor for a vampire but I guess with that neighborhood.

Ironic of course seeing him as the rogue player, the outlaw riding into town. Now he’s the freakin’ president of W&H.


BTW, how sad is it when you miss the opening credits? Even before the dirge for the axe, I miss those old credits. Especially that shot of CC looking over his shoulder at the PC. That really underlines their chemistry and how they fit physically together so well w/o the staging and focusing lighting of B/A on BtVS. I love how she can’t wear a full length shirt but it’s cold enough to wear a long jacket. I miss him jumping out of that window flailing his arms and her excitement over the invoice. That shot in the sun when she’s worried about Angel.

I miss the old Angel who was the faceless shadow. Cut off from humanity and caring about the world. And how Cordelia was the one who helped him join the world and become part of it. This episode really set up that relationship, his need and how she fulfilled his life. About how the mission is more than lives, it’s souls. Specifically his.

I love Doyle’s little talk about Sunnydale, how high school (implicitly B/A) is over and that it’s time for grown up things. Like say, a grown up relationship based on friendship as opposed to bad metaphors and gaping dialogue. “A could mean anything, it doesn’t have to mean Angel.”

It’s been so long since I’ve seen the party scene. Y’all are right about how he just lights up when he sees her. Like how he picks her unseen voice out of the crowd and noise. Can recognize her talking, her scent and her long hair from the back.

He’s actually interested in her, asking about her and giving her a genuine smile. So different from the guy who moped around the Bronze. I love how his voice is higher and more animated than the distraction with Tina. He doesn’t look as lost. I love that raised eyebrow and his indulgent smile over her comments and his “cure” comment. The way he smirks over her clumsy words and gestures.

She’s already obviously lying over her life, the fast way she describes her condo in Malibu. You wonder if he can tell. She’s also so comfortable with him and his “grr” problem. Loved how she’s already got him puzzled as she goes spinning off. Is it me or does he look a little disappointed as she walks off first.

I also wonder if he’s keeping an eye out for her later on, as he’s waiting for Tina.

Can I just say that I miss Charisma? I love how that little apartment scene. One dress literally in the closet and the carefully unwrapped finger food How her stoic expression and no dialogue still contributes to the character development. No waterworks or histrionics but that stolid sense of persevering.

I love that Winters picks out Cordelia in a room full of starlets. Love how she’s got that intrinsic attraction for vampires. Of course that includes our boy.

BTW, nice segue way where Angel’s telling Stacy there’s no one left for him to care for or love. No emotional weakness in his heart for Winters or his enemies to exploit. Next shot? The raven haired costar. No foreshadowing, not really.

Watching it again I didn’t catch his comments to Doyle about sharing his feelings the first time. How he didn’t want to share and didn’t want to open up. Not until he finds Russell and then he’ll share. Of course, guess who’s with him when he’s finally finding his emotions? Allowing himself to feel and express them? (with explosives but it counts) Timing is everything.

I swear, Charisma’s hair should be billed a supporting player. Straight and gleaming at the party, flowing and curly with Winters for that classic DID dynamic. Messy enough to fly into her face and be dramatic as she’s being swung around by Angel. Don’t miss Angel and Doyle’s matching outfits.

I do miss Charisma though. I love how her monologue goes from bubbly, superficial and a high tone to the lower, confessional, poignant reflections. That hesitation and desperation that that then swings into a funny, snappy dialogue with Russell and his denial over being a vampire. Wonder if CC would ever do voices for animation. But she’s such a good physical actress too. The way she uses her whole body, drooping shoulders, fumbling hands, etc.

I love how she recognizes his voice in the dark. How she immediately feels safe with him but then she turns to concern when she sees him getting beaten. That little call to him.

I swear this scene totally cemented me as a C/A shipper. I love how he rolls towards her, to protect him. It’s going to be a reflex pretty soon. The way he blocks the bullets for her with her flinching in the back.

I love how he reaches for her and she immediately wraps her hands around his neck before they go over the banister. Then the way he leans on her while they’re running for the door.

Even when they reach the car she stays twisted in the car seat for an extra second, making sure he’s ok in the back seat.

I love the bandage scene, how it sets up the pattern of her bandaging him up. Love her little “sorry” when he flinches from her touching the wound. The way he doesn’t growl at her. Not to mention the way he watches her while she talks about being safe from Russell. That frozen look that indicates that he’s thinking along the same lines as Doyle about her safety.

I didn’t notice that the Purple Garanimals were in the pilot. They seem to have this purple theme going from her raisin party dress to his eggplant shirt in the boardroom scene.

I love how she’s immediately the spirit and energy in his life even if it’s screaming about bantam weight cockroaches. Hmmm? Coincidence that it’s right after that call to Buffy? Where they communicate in their usual empathetic way?

Always wondered if those were his clothes she’s wearing in that scene. Doubtful they would’ve let her go home until things were settled. The pants and all are so big on her. She’s got the bulky sleeves rolled up and they’re barely above her wrists and check out the back, that’s not a woman’s cut.

Love how she inserts herself into his life. The way she’s already comfortable enough to tell him what he should do. That it’s a “we” and not a “you.” They’ve already got that negotiating dynamic on things.

Especially like that moment when she drops her act with him. Lets him see her vulnerabilities and face his rejection when she asks if he could use her. But he does and we see this sweet little exchange of private smiles on both sides. Genuine ones.

And yes, it’s canon when Doyle establishes that she’s his connection to the world and the humanizing element in his life. And yeah, as he noticed, she’s a hottie.
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Old 09-30-2003, 09:29 AM   #14
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Oh, Kar. I just love you. I love your subtext reports--I'd forgotten how much I loved them until you came out with this one. Shit, these just *make* the show for me now. I'm excited about watching Angel again on TNT just so I can notice these little details! Wah! Can we have S1 Angel and Cordy back?

Kel
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Old 09-30-2003, 09:50 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by starlet2367
Oh, Kar. I just love you. I love your subtext reports--I'd forgotten how much I loved them until you came out with this one. Kel
I agree toatlly. Kar, you are the subtext queen.

I just love that confused look Angel gets on his face when he's dealing with Cordelia in "City Of". It's a look that will be around for most of season 1, and I love it. If you ask me, trying to "get" Cordelia is part of what humanized Angel. So often, the other people in his life were happy to let him brood and be stand-offish. But not Cordy. Working with Cordy every day, he almost had to open up and loosen up.

By the way, as mentioned above, love how, when Cordy told him to get the box, he was actually doing it before he caught himself.

Watching "City Of" reminded me how totally intense Angel was. Now, I can't believe I thought DB wouldn't be able to handle his own show.
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